i am living for the day that the harry potter movies get a remake and we see ginny’s bat-bogey hex in action
i am living for the day that the harry potter movies get a remake and we see ginny’s bat-bogey hex in action
This is indeed meant to be about movie inconsistencies and not book ones, haha, but since you raised the topic -
I think that when it comes to exact numbers, th e answer to many of our questions is ‘JK Rowling is bad at math.’ Which is fine with me, if I’m honest.
Fans generally figure that the population of Wizarding Britain is in the low thousands, and that the student body of Hogwarts is, yeah, about 300 strong. (We could even possibly argue that these numbers have diminished due to Wizarding UK just having been through a war, and not counting the families of the growing Muggleborn population, etc.)
So that is definitely very, very small.
The thing is, though, I’m not surprised they don’t all know each other at Hogwarts. I know it’s not a boarding school, so things are slightly different, but I work in a middle school with 230 children. While I know all their faces, I definitely don’t know all their names. Especially the more introverted kids, or those without a deep background knowledge of the Wizarding World (like Harry).
That’s the best I can do to explain
it. It’s a shaky explanation at best, and I can understand your frustration. :)
Alright, so we all know that one of the most unforgivable things that happened in the movies concerning Ron is giving Hermione his" If you want to kill Harry “ line, but the hatred I feel towards this is not just about me being angry at Kloves showing off his disrespectful favoritism by giving away Ron’s lines, but me being angry at just how badly he screwed over ALL of the Golden Trio in one simple scene. The entire Shrieking Shack scene was a disservice to the book and the Golden Trio, and by extension Sirius and Remus( but that’s for another day), so let me let breakdown exactly why I hate this scene so much.
Note th at this is a long post because I have a lot of feelings about this.
Now, let us start with the most obvious problem, what was done to Ron.
In the book, the “if you want to kill Harry ” line comes from Ron after he’s just been bodily dragged by Sirius, who was in his Grim form, a form Ron was deathly afraid of, into the Shrieking Shack, after having his leg broken in such a brutal way, Harry was able to audibly able hear the crack. In the time that it took Harry and Hermione to get to Ron, he was stuck with Sirius; who took his wand, who Ron knows is brutal enough to escape Azkaban , a fortress he had grown up all his life being told is inescapable and break into Hogwarts, who at the time everyone thought was a convicted murdered, who Ron no doubt grew up hearing horror stories: about; completely alone, handicapped and in an immeasurable amount of pain. Could you imagine what could have been going through his head? A thirteen-year-old with no means t o defend himself, trapped with the man who not only killed his best friend’s parents but 13 innocent people and laughed about it while getting arrested.
Any normal person would have been terrified.
But not Ron. Ron was determined whereas other people would have been afraid. His first reaction when Harry shows up is to warn him of the danger through the pain that’s he’s feeling. When that doesn’t work his second reaction is to protect Harry when he puts himself in immediate danger.
Sirius addressing Harry, and Harry putting himself in danger gave Ron the sheer willpower to not only pull Harry back from the danger but to stand on a BROKEN LEG, look into the face of a convicted murderer and tell him that if he wanted to kill Harry he had to kill him first.
You cannot buy loyalty like that.
This is clear cut proof that Ron was perfectly willing to die for his friend.
In this moment, Ron is to Harry what Harry was to Dumbledo re in the Chamber of Secrets.
When Ron said this line in the book, I had to put it down to absorb what he just did. The sheer impact had me shook.
And this is my ultimate problem with giving the line to Hermione. It takes away the impact. When Hermione says this line in the movie it’s not an earnest declaration of loyalty but an attempt to put on a brave front. She doesn’t seem to think she can back up what’s she’s saying, whereas Ron had complete conviction behind his words. He wasn’t just trying to be brave, he was willing to stand beside his friend in the face of danger, injured, in pain and at a complete disadvantage. I think this is shown perfectly in that Ron is at Harry’s side in the book instead of in front of him like Hermione was in the movies when this line is said. It’s not ‘I’m going to try to protect you’ i t’s 'I’d go to hell and back with you’.
There is none of thi s with Movie Hermione, there is no struggling through pain, no fear, no overcoming that fear. For Ron, it was a character establishing moment, for Hermione it’s just a throwaway line with no meaning or impact.
But it doesn’t stop there, because Kloves takes away another important line, this time from Harry, the main freakin character. The ‘I trusted you’ line.
This brings favoritism to a whole new level, because Hermione had absolutely no right to be given that line.
Remus was until this point Harry’s only legitimate link to his parents. Sure there’s Hagrid and Dumbledore, but they would not have known them as personally as Remus. Remus is an invaluable source of knowledge to Harry. He could tell Harry what his dad was like when teachers weren’t around, what his mom was like, and it would all be a personal account. It doesn’t help that Remus’s formal introduction to Harry is him saving him from the dementors . There would defiantly be some hero worship going one.
Finally, Harry had an adult that he could know on a personal level as a parental figure, even if he was a teacher. He spent hours with Remus alone and defenseless, thinking of Remus as someone who genuinely cares for him outside of him being Harry Potter, who helped him other come a great fear. But the most important thing he did was put his truest in Remus even after the fact that one DADA professor was working for Voldemort and the other had no problem attempting to erase his memories.
You can just feel the betrayal and hurt that he experienced when he sees that Remus and Sirius are in league with each other.
(And yes we all know how it really turns out but at this point Harry didn’t)
But once again the impact is lost, because the line comes from Hermione and to be frank, who cares if Hermione trusted Remus or not, or if she felt betrayed. She didn’t have that emotional tie to Remus, she didn’t put herself in a vulnerable position with Remus for weeks. Her feeling betrayed didn’t matter because she wasn’t the one who lost her parents to the madman her professor just embraced.
It made no sense to give her this line.
This was a moment that would have been amazing to see come to life. The tension is at an all-time high and it keeps going higher. It’s the perfect blend of drama and action. Here we get our first in-depth glimpse at Harry’s anger and what it can do to his character. Yeah, we see glimpses of it in the first two books, but it’s really expanded on here. His anger makes him reckless, his hate make him murderous , and the betrayal from Remus brings these feeling to its peak. It was the perfect look into how all those negative feelings altered him in the fifth book, but it came to its height in this moment. We could’ve all of that on screen, but we didn’t get it.
Instead, we got that hammy scene in the movies with Harry crying under his invisibility clock.
And the injustice doesn’t end there.
It comes full circle because this scene doesn’t just take away from Harry and Ron but Hermione too!
In the book, Hermione is terrified of what is going on. She talks very timidly and politely to Sirius and Remus, she whispers all of her words, she freaks out when she helps stun Snape, She’s so horrified of Pettigrew she cannot physical speak when he comes close to her, she closes her eyes when Sirius and Remus are about to kill Pettigrew.
The words to describe Hermione in this scene all point to extreme fear. She’s petrified, she’s whimpering. And that brings a whole new level to her character, because though she’s afraid of what’s going on, she just as invested at protecting Harry as Ron, but in a completely different way than in the movies. She shows her inner Gryffindor by being deathly afraid but stil l tacking Sirius with Ron when she’s given the chance. She helps hold Harry back when he tries to go to Sirius , she offers support in every way she can while still being afraid. I don’t know about you but courage in the face of extreme fear is more admirable to me than being a hardened badass all the time.
But of course, this wasn’t shown in the movie because Hermione has to be a Knight Templar and tackle danger with no fear and basically be a warrior goddess always ready to bail everyone out.
Kloves favoritism not only damaged Ron and Harry but Hermione as well. The irony is he was so blinded by that favoritism that he made Hermione an entirely different character in the movies. She can’t be dynamic. She can only be one of two things, Smart or Badass. She can’t be a flawed character and thus she can’t be herself at all.
I could talk for hours about everything wrong with just the Shrieking shack scene alone but this post is already long enough. Ultimately, Steve Kloves fucked up everyone’s character, he didn’t get anyone right, not even Hermione his so called favorite character. The Shrieking Shack was the scene that showed me Kloves ineptitude at portraying these characters and even though four out of the eight movies are very important to me I cannot overlook just how badly they screwed up these characters.
Scene I needed in the deathly hallows movie number 777: the trio laughing their asses off cause of Ron and drinking pumpkin juice after having robbed gringotts and escaped with a partially blind dragon
Wow… just wow. I’m speechless. I fear that sometimes Emma’s mouth might get ahead of her brain. I hope that she went home, realized what she said and regretted it. Fe minism is NOT about throwing the boys under the bus. Hermione was brilliant, yes. But she was also flawed. She had NO clue what they were doing on that hunt. When Ron left she literally crumbled into herself (yes not entirely her fault - blame the locket) when he returned they both let Ron take the lead. Hermione has the plan? Hermione is in control? You mean the Hermione who panicked and forgot she was a witch? The Hermione petrified in the hospital wing? The Hermione who tried to take so many classes she made herself sick? That Hermione? They are all brilliant and flawed. That’s why we love them.
Yes she’s wonderfully loyal but she’s far from the glue… the boys are quite happy together when she’s preoccupied with classes and her pride (she could have just apologized to Ron about her cat.. but no.) Oh Emma… this quote makes me sad and I very much hope that it came from a genuine place of wanting to empower young girls and you simply forgot to think things through before you spoke.
Agree with everything you said. I love her, but I read that interview and went “nope, you got that wrong, honey”. I also read somewhere else, I think, but also recently, that she said something like… Hermione is kind and compassionate and puts up with everything all the time, and… that’s not entirely true either??
Of course, having played the movies and their particular version of Hermione is influenci ng Emma’s comments and I don’t think we can fault her too much when that is the material she was given to portray, but book!Hermione is so much more and so much more real than her version… and I wish she was telling people it’s okay to be book!Hermione.
I think at this point 90% of society, including Emma Watson, basically have the movie versions of the characters in their heads. Most people don’t reread books they liked as kids, and most people I know have never even read the books in the first place and only watch the movies. So at some point I guess the movie!canon took over and this is where we are now, at the opposite of feminism, where Hermione is this perfect woman and the others are just kind of there.
Funnily enough, I’ve written one of my bachelor papers about this - this is actually a common problem in these wannabe feminist stories - they make women flawless instead of realistic normal people. Gives you an ins ight into how many writers (who are often men) apparently think women have to be super humans to even participate in adventures like these. In this case, they added to this by throwing male characters like Ron completely under the bus, as if this weird glorification of women wasn’t annoying enough on its own.
And it’ll always baffle me how the first movie was still relatively good in terms of character representation, with Ron being witty and loving and brave but also lacking tackt and compassion esp for those that aren’t his friends. And Hermione was still normal was well, a good friend and obviously incredibly talented, brave and intelligent but also arrogant and narrow-minded at times. And then it went downhill from there - I guess when people loved Rupert’s performance as scared Ron in CoS, they were like YAY LET’S KEEP HIM THIS WAY FOREVER AND MAKE HIM DUMB, CLUMSY AND SELFISH TOO
Which must’ve been a pretty dumb move even from their pers pective, because how do you justify the fact that dumb Ron and perfect Hermione end up together at the end of series? How do you make a moment like Ron leaving them in 7.1 stand out if Ron’s always been a selfish jerk to begin with? And that’s also the reason Ron and Hermione’s roles were so useless in 7.2, because they came up with this stupid comic relief thing of Ron suddenly being of use and Hermione going WOW WHAT.
As a young screenwriter, this has taught me the importance of creating complex on-screen characters. And yes, that’s possible, even for mass audiences and even without getting rid of humour and comic relief.
I have very mixed feelings about the movies (they cooled my hp love for a while, until the original book focused version of pottermore brought it back, until it to became about the movies. That’s a rant for another time)
I hate that the movie canon has taken over the book canon both in story and visual. My favorite period of hp merch was before and just around the release of the first two movies. There were so many version of the hp world that existed. Even in the early video games there were unique takes on things and book influences that existed. Now everything is so movie focused. :/
Though best new merch is the first lego game. It pulls from the books and doesn’t feel like a movie carbon copy. Seriously look up the old game/board games they are amazing.
Sorry this was a hermione post and I totally agree. Hermione and Ron are both so much more complex and interesting in the original text. And one thing I love about the books there all equal friends with each other. It’s not one core aspect. As someone who had this kind of best friend trio in middle school, each person, relationship and combo of friends is unique. People within that group don’t serve as a part of a person (there is no id, ego, or superego). Each person is a mix of a bunch of different elements. And the creation of this super hermione, and the flattening of there characters personalities is part of the reason the later movies left me a bit cold.